Thanks for sharing your thoughts, Elena. I am happy to hear that the point of the article resonated with your understanding and experience. Unfortunately, I don’t know of any other literature that specifically discusses the Ashtanga practice from a systems thinking perspective. My understanding draws from my own long term personal experience of the practice, integrated with my past studies (and continuing self-education) in the fields of psychology and biology – especially ecology and the emerging systems based approaches. Please do keep in touch and share any other ideas or thoughts you may have in this realm, as I am always happy to discuss and collaborate.

Thank you so MUCH for this article. It is amazing! I am a Psychology student with a strong interest into Complex Dynamic System Theory (and some minor reservations about reductionism) and it’s application in Psychotherapy, as well as an Ashtanga Yoga practitioner. When I started practicing Ashtanga Yoga, I could immediately recognize the connection it has with my academic interests, but finding someone who thinks the same about it and who actually writes it down is super exciting for me. Is there any literature that you can recommend?
Funnily, I ended up here because me and my boyfriend were investigating the reason of a quite stubborn tightness around my left hip that is reoccurring. We were searching for the muscle that would most likely be the reason for the pain and uncomfortable feelings (including difficulties to gain full hip mobility in Padmasana, Marychasana etc.). Looking for the muscle that would most likely be the cause, did not work out really. Also, because the pain can only be pinpointed by using a lacrosse ball when lying in a specific position on the stomach and seems to be quite deeply rooted within the hip, so that it cannot actually be reached or located so easily. We kind of came to the conclusion, that it is most likely the result of many factors and also that there are probably many muscles throughout the whole body involved. My boyfriend added that since the pain is reoccurring that there seems to be quite a strong resistance (on a mental level) to change… I could relate to this in some ways. Now, after rationalizing quite a lot about the pain and tightness and reading your article, I really get your point. I think that most of us tend to think way too much about the details of the practice and physical sensations that arise with it. It seems entirely normal to experience uncomfortableness if practicing daily. Through the practice our system will certainly has to reorganize itself. There will be times where it will be stable and times where it will be less stable. But chaos is needed for a new organization to emerge so why bother so much about it.
Viewing ourselves as complex systems that are continuously changing is beautiful in many ways and definitely makes me accept my hip injury pain as simply being part of the processes.

Thank you so much for this great article.
Elena

Hi Adam,

Thanks for your comment. Sorry to hear about your struggles with your injuries. Unfortunately, I can’t give specific advice over the internet to someone I haven’t worked with. There are many factors which make each person and situation unique, and so I would need to work with you in person in order to be able to advise you on what to do.

In general, with that type of injury, you definitely should back off, as you have done. It certainly is possible to do a short and modified Ashtanga practice, but I strongly suggest that you seek a qualified teacher who understands the practice and your injury well, and to work closely with that teacher in person.

The final thing I can say, is that when one has a very strong desire to attain a particular posture, or level in the practice, that desire can obfuscate one’s ability to feel the intelligence of the body and to make appropriate decisions based on that intelligence. In all cases, I recommend trying to listen to the intelligence of the body, and make actions and decisions based on that, rather than based on a visualized goal of where one wants to be.

Lastly, you may find this e-book by Gregory Lehman to be helpful and interesting:

https://static1.squarespace.com/static/57260f1fd51cd4d1168668ab/t/590dca266b8f5b01a7f97ceb/1494075961206/recovery+strategies+pain+guidebook+2017.pdf

Best of luck to you. Don’t give up and use the wisdom gained from you past experiences in moving forward.

Thanks for your informative article, I enjoyed it. Last year I tore my left medial meniscus during practice. I ended up having both knees imaged with MRI and it turned out that my right medial meniscus was also torn, but the symptoms weren’t as severe as the left. The left was catching when bent and I couldn’t do any seated postures. I had surgery within 1 month as I wanted to get back to a full practice. The recovery was hard, taking at least 6 months to get back to where I was before injuring the left knee. Now unfortunately, I think I may have torn the right meniscus. Again it’s very sore in seated posture and is catching when bent, I’ve stopped practicing to let it rest, but now I’m just so unsure of everything, I don’t want to go through the surgery again, but what I’ve read, the meniscus normally never heals. The most disheartening thing though is that since the surgery I have been very careful and mindful of any knee pain. I backed off every time. I’m so confused and am thinking should I just leave it and see if time heals, or the very least takes the catching symptoms away? Or should I walk away from the Ashtanga method alogethet, as I keep on injuring myself? Have you seen these type of reoccurring knee injuries?

What do you think?

Adam

Hello Maya.

Rolf is not the teacher I was referring to in this particular story. I am sorry to hear about your bad experience though.

Inappropriate teaching methods can certainly be harmful. It is also important for students to be clear on their own limitations and boundaries in the student-teacher interaction. I can’t comment on specific incidents that I was not there to witness or be a part of. I can only comment on trends and patterns in my own experiences and experiences of others that I have directly witnessed.

All the best to you
Iain

All the best,

Hi Amy,

I’m glad you found the article helpful. I don’t like to give specific advice over the internet, but it does sound like you should probably back off and ease up in your practice until things start to feel better. If you are experiencing persistent pain in one area during a particular posture, you probably shouldn’t be adjusted deeper into it, beyond what you are capable of doing on your own. When working on your own, I would only go so far as you start to feel the pain, and resist trying to move further into the posture until the pain starts to dissipate. It can take time for the body to integrate deeper changes, and a healthy sense of restraint becomes necessary with long term practice. Best of luck with it!